It would be impossible to identify and round up all 10 to 11 million of the current undocumented.

Anyways I want to do a really good job of outlining the major arguments about immigration, as I think it is one of the major issues facing our country. So what I want to do is sort of a wikipedia style group effort of outlining the issues… with that said, I'll just jump in.

John McCain said: "It would be impossible to identify and round up all 10 to 11 million of the current undocumented." He said this in a May 13, 2005 press release titled "Members of Congress Introduce Comprehensive Border Security & Immigration Reform Bill [S 2611].

In the future, I would like to outline all the issues here, but for now we can have a Normal conversation.


Here are some of the reasons that I have heard to disagree with McCain:

1. No one is proposing that we "round illegal aliens up". 


2. Illegal Aliens came to America on their own; they don't need someone to drive them away 


3. You wouldn't have to get all 11 million illegal aliens to go back, just 1/2 of them in 10 years would be a good start. 


4. According to Wikipedia their are 77 million students in America (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_the_United_States). Lets be conservative and say that only 1 in 7 of our elementary and secondary students ride a school bus each morning. This means that our local communities all transport 10 million students each morning. Their are buss drivers that are not driving buses each and every summer, and kids that are not going to school. Local communities could run a program that would only last each summer. Whenever illegal immigrants are found, during the operation of normal police work, they could be incarcerated until their is a buss load of them, a buss driver, and a couple of policemen all get to take a field trip to Mexico. If they have legitimate reasons to be in America, they can file the necessary paperwork from their home country. 

Have I forgot anything? Can we say something better? Instead of just producing quality, I want to go back and say things as best as they can be said. If you agree with McCain, why?


A technique taught in Getting to Yes: Negotiating Agreement Without Giving In, by Roger Fisher and William L. Ury, is to focus on interest not positions. In addition to having a place for listing pros and cons, I would like to have a place for the listing of interest. If we are going to make progress sometimes we have to stop listening to the stupid things people are saying, and try to figure out what their motivation is, and what makes them want to say those stupid things. It will often turn out that the real reason someone supports something has nothing to do with the arguments that they try to use to advance their ideas.


With that said, here are some of the interest of those who agree and disagree with McCain:


Interest of those who agree:

1. The desire to see America grow in size to compete with China.


2. The desire to make America look more like them, if they are Hispanic.


3. The desire for America to be more diverse, if they have liberal guilt.


4. The desire to see America more Catholic.


5. Financial interest if your company would have to move overseas if not for cheap illegal labor.


6. Financial interest if you just don't like paying your workers very much.

Interest of those who disagree: %

1. Rule of law (if some people have to come in the legal way, and wait in line, everyone should have to come in the legal way, and wait their turn in line).


2. The desire to not see America become more Catholic.


3. The desire to keep American culture less diverse, or with positive spin more "unified".

Well, I got things started, please HELP ME OUT! I think that we can basically set all the arguments about 10 million aside, and until you can convince people that the rule of law is more important than whatever their underlying interest are, we are going to have a tough row to hoe. So that is my next post: The rule of law is more important than compassion for illegal immigrants.